Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?

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I am currently GMing an AW game, but I am still unclear about some of the rules.

About the "Under pressure"-move....it seems that it is by far the most important move, and getting a high Cool is imperative. Can anyone explain this to me?

Also, doesn't AW need a "kick ass"-move like in Monster of the week? What do you usually use when you try to, say, shoot someone?

Lastly, some moves do not describe what needs to happen for them to be activated. For example, Insao like Draino from the Gunlogger. When does that move happen? Is it on all the time, giving the gunlogger a constant plus?

thanks.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 10:06:37 AM by wingsofwax »

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2014, 11:56:39 AM »
Hello,

Act under fire is a solid move that does apply to alot of situations, notably useful as a catch all for any task that requires a roll but doesn't fall under the others (for things like stealth or movement or simple tasks done under duress), although I wouldn't say that its the most important one as you will suffer in some way from the absence of any of the basic moves.

If you are trying to shoot someone then it either comes under Go aggro or seize by force; Go aggro if they are unable or unwilling to defend themselves with violence and seize by force if they are willing to fight back. To better phrase it, if you are trying to just flat kill someone and they can't/won't stop you then effectively you demand a unfair request i.e I want you to die choking on your own blood or take the harm I am capable of dealing. If on the other hand its a straight up fight then its a seize by force, in theory you could try and seize something intangible like 'victory' but I've found its useful to try and steer players towards tangible goals "Take the bunker." "drive them from behind the rubble" "force a rout" or something but if you are just looking to disdain fictional advantages in favour of a straight brawl then you would just disdain the "you take definite hold of it" in favour of the other options that allow you to do more/take less damage until the other side withdraws or falls over.

Several moves don't need to used and are active all the time; alot of the stat boost ones, like 'insano like draino' or 'fucking wacknut', are just straight boosts that the character adds onto their stats in effect trading a move slot for a stat option. If it doesn't say they need to activated, typically by the crucial 'When', then its active all the time.

Hope that helps.

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2014, 12:28:33 PM »
Thank you very much for your detailed answer, I appreciate it.

Just to clarify; shooting a gun can happen using almost any stat? Meaning that the stats are metaphorical in some way.



Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2014, 02:34:58 PM »
Yes, to a degree;
If you are say shooting targets (inanimate objects) that might come under act under fire [cool] or go aggro [hard/cool]
As part of a deal or possibly as a skinner chosen art (hot)
Part of a ritual to open your brain (weird)

But predominately it will come under Hard and sometimes Cool.  The stats are a little generic but they represent aspects of the character's personality.

*

Munin

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Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2014, 02:39:53 PM »
No, the stats have very defined uses.  The issue is not so much "shooting a gun" as it is "inflicting harm."  For the most part, if you want to inflict Harm (i.e. damage) on someone, you're rolling+Hard.  There are exceptions, but in most cases in which you want to hurt someone, the other moves are used to get you into a position where you can go aggro or seize by force.

One of the things that is useful to remember is that AW doesn't have "skills."  The characters are assumed to know their business.  As such, you can use a gun/knife/machete/blowgun/whatever with an assumed level of expertise.  So when it comes to using violence, the biggest determining factor is not how skilled, fast, or strong you are, but rather how mean, vicious, cold-blooded, or determined you are.  It's not about whether you have the skill to hit your target when you pull the trigger, but rather whether you have the stones to look a man in the eye and make the conscious decision to end his life.  This conceptual construct is intentional, and is very much part of the "flavor" of AW.

To some extent, the construct is used for act under fire as well.  So when you're trying to sneak into the enemy camp in the dead of night, the issue is not how skilled at moving quietly you are, but rather whether you will lose your shit and panic when you realize you've just stepped on a sleeping enemy ganger.  If you flub your roll, maybe you freeze up, at which point the now-wakened ganger sees you and yells a warning (at which point all hell breaks loose).  Or maybe you roll a 10+, keep your wits about you, and without missing a beat give the guy a kick and snarl, "quit snoring, asshole!" (at which point he rolls over and goes back to sleep because this has happened to him a thousand times before, and neither he nor anyone else in earshot thinks twice about it).  Or maybe something in between.

In some sense the 7-9 range for act under fire is the metaphor through which much of AW operates.  Worse outcome, hard bargain, or ugly choice - because the basic move is so nebulous, it becomes very easy to tailor this to whatever it is that the player is trying to do.  With a nebulous trigger comes a flexible result, which (from the perspective of the MC) is great!

Because AW is "fiction first," the assumption is often that if you are attempting something dangerous, something bad will happen (because if it didn't there wouldn't be any drama).  The question then becomes not "how do I keep something bad from happening at all," to "how do I handle the bad thing that has happened?"  And that is why act under fire is so nebulous and why the Cool stat is used to resolve it.  In some sense they are mechanically the same, but conceptually they are quite different and will result in different player expectations (and different narrative styles).
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 02:44:21 PM by Munin »

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2014, 03:13:50 PM »
Here's another way firing a gun could be...

MC: Hey, Bronze, I heard you're gonna make a run across the field, right? Well, Guts' boys are gonna pop out from the low brick wall to spray you with lead if you try it. What do you do?

Bronze: Okay, I'll haul ass as fast as I can, but as soon as I see them coming up, I'll duck and roll. Hopefully I'm outta their sight enough to buy me a minute.

MC: Sure, act under fire.

Bronze: Shit, it's a 9.

MC: Oh, sure, you hit the ground about three-quarters of the field in... you'll need to crawl the rest of the way, and god help you if one of them gets the idea to climb over that wall.

Lilac: Wait wait, can I aid Bronze?

MC: Sure thing! How do you do it?

Lilac: I can see the goons, right? As I see them coming up, I'll lay down some suppressing fire. I'm not really aiming to kill if I can help it, but I want to keep them down.

MC: Sure thing, roll to aid.


So, in this case, firing a gun is actually an Hx roll.

- Alex

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2014, 04:09:01 PM »
"So, in this case, firing a gun is actually an Hx roll."

This was what I was looking for - that the stats are chosen by the context. The stats are interchangeable when called for.

Maybe you could have a Sniper Move where you use Sharp instead of Cold? Would that work?

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2014, 04:23:51 PM »
It's not the stats, but the move that's chosen by context. Start with the fiction, compare it to the "when" part of each of the move descriptions. The best match is the right move to use.

Example 1:  You've been waiting for this for weeks. You've worked your way into NPC gang leader Brock's inner circle; he trusts you and has no idea that was your sister he killed all those years ago. He's bent over his workbench, back to you, cleaning his rifle. You pull your revolver, put it to the back of his head, and pull the trigger. Bang. 2-harm, ap, no roll needed.

Example 2: You're scared shitless of Brock, this was a terrible plan, you don't know what he knows, your heart is pounding, but he's got his back to you and it's now or never. With shaking hands you draw the revolver. Roll Acting Under Fire to get the shot off before he realizes what you're doing.

For a sniper move that uses Sharp instead of Cool or Hard, I think the way to do that by the book is Read A Sitch to find the right spot to lay your ambush ("best way in"), and act on that to gain +1 to the Seize By Force. Or be a Driver with Good In The Clinch and then Act Under Fire with Sharp.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 04:36:39 PM by Borogove »

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2014, 04:27:34 PM »
Sure, a move like this is in other games, like The Sprawl.

Here is an example...

"Keen Eye: When your target's unaware of you and you take a shot you give away your position, then do your harm or roll+sharp. If you roll, on a 7-9, choose one. On a 10+, choose two.

- you don't give away your position
- you do your harm
- you've frightened your target or put them off balance"

"Bullet Time: When you open your brain to a fight, trade harm with your enemies and roll+weird. On a hit, choose one. On a 10+, choose one and the MC will grant you insight into the battle.

- You avoid all harm
- You do incredible harm (+2-harm messy)
- You get wherever you'd like unimpeded
- One of your enemies is in total awe of you"

I don't know, these are just examples, but there's a lot to be done with custom moves.
But, Borogove is right in that it's the moves that are chosen, not the stats... but, they're also wrong in that a sniper would, by default, either be simply doing damage or, at best, going aggro and not seizing by force (at least, until the first shot is fired and your cover is blown).

- Alex

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2014, 04:35:34 PM »
they're also wrong in that a sniper would, by default, either be simply doing damage or, at best, going aggro and not seizing by force (at least, until the first shot is fired and your cover is blown).

Right, my bad, if the position is good, the sniper can just deal harm without a roll. It's only Seize By Force if the target can shoot back effectively.

I don't think Go Aggro applies unless the sniper is trying to get someone to do something ("let the girl go or I put a bullet through your head!"), but I've seen conflicting interpretations of the move.

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2014, 06:00:54 AM »
Go Aggro applies and fit very well the function is just to do damage, effectively it just becomes;

When you Go Aggro trying to snipe someone, Roll + hard
On a 10+ they take your weapons harm or a injury you name (up to and including death)
On a 7-9
• get the hell out of your way
• barricade themselves securely in
• give you something they think you want
• back off calmly, hands where you can see
• tell you what you want to know (or what you want to hear)
• + the 10+ options

As you can see, in that representation unless the GM wants you to succeed then you need a ten plus to really do the business. Sniping is hard but in some respects it should be hard, sometimes it is a very anticlimatic way of dealing with problems in games which can rob games of novelty and it can be a very dispassionate way of dealing with problems which in some respects is counter-productive to building up drama and narrative.

And if it was me GMing then I would probably tack a act under fire afterwards if it seemed appropriate to get away without being caught/spotted/discovered.

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2014, 10:01:24 AM »
Thanks again, very helpful.

The thing that I really needed to hear might seem very simple to you, but the fact that "Go Aggro" can be interpreted simply as "Inflict Harm" is something I've been wondering about ever since I began reading AW.

Just throwing another idea out there: Could different weapons require different stats? I get that you go for the moves, not the stats, so each weapon type should probably have a move for itself...I just like the idea that all stats can be used to inflict harm.

*

Munin

  • 417
Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2014, 10:34:34 AM »
Many playbooks have stat substitution moves that allow you to use a different stat when making a move.  So the move remains the same, but the underlying stat you use is different (and usually better).  For instance, both the Battlebabe's ice cold and the Brainer's direct-brain whisper projection allow a player to effectively go aggro, but instead of rolling+Hard, the Battlebabe will roll+Cool and the Brainer will roll+Weird.  The Maestro'D has a similar move that allows roll+Hot.

But there's nothing to say you couldn't create a custom move for a particular weapon or item that uses another stat.  So maybe "anytime you go aggro or seize by force with the temporal distortion amplifier, roll+Weird instead of +Hard."  Or anytime you use the finicky pinpoint precision laser to inflict harm on someone or something, roll+Sharp.

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2014, 01:39:46 PM »
Thanks again, very helpful.

The thing that I really needed to hear might seem very simple to you, but the fact that "Go Aggro" can be interpreted simply as "Inflict Harm" is something I've been wondering about ever since I began reading AW.

Just throwing another idea out there: Could different weapons require different stats? I get that you go for the moves, not the stats, so each weapon type should probably have a move for itself...I just like the idea that all stats can be used to inflict harm.

I guess it's controversial, but "Go Aggro" is - in addition to the "threat" move - also the "do violence when they can't properly respond" move.

So, different stats for weapons... usually I wouldn't do this, but in some cases it might make sense?
If something is really different, I'd write up a custom move...

"Big Darn Laser: When you configure the big darn laser and fire it off, it takes a few minutes and you do 4-harm ap messy loud, but roll+sharp anyway. On a hit, choose two. On a 10+, choose three. On a miss, you've set it up wrong, so you might want to abandon ship...
- you do +1-harm
- you do +1-harm
- you don't do any collateral damage (-messy)
- you don't have to wait to recharge the laser
- your fuel supply isn't running low
"

"Razor Expert: When you get in close with your wicked razor blades, roll+cool. On a hit, pick two. On a 10+, pick three instead.
- you do 2-harm, but cut right around and through any armor they're wearing
- you do 3-harm (only pick to do harm once per person)
- you avoid harm from any melee targets
- they're bleeding heavy
- you disarm them"

I dunno, could be like that.
- Alex

Re: Does "React under fire" become a "catch-all" in your games?
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2014, 06:25:05 PM »
I haven't made many gear related custom moves but here is one:

explosive vest (intimate 4-harm area refill)

Sometimes people don't take you seriously. So you strap explosives to your body, walk up to them, and make some demands. Other times you don't intend to walk away. At least you won't be around to worry about the consequences.

Here's a custom move (untested) for the explosive vest:

When an NPC triggers their explosive vest and you have some forewarning, roll acting under fire to escape the blast. On a 10+ you get out fine, cinematic explosion in the background. On a 7-9, you get out but you lose something, choose either someone you cared about who dies in your place or suffer 2-harm. On a miss take 4-harm and the MC will get back to you when you regain consciousness.

When you choose to trigger your explosive vest, roll+hard. On a hit, choose someone (not a PC). They die with you. On 10+ choose a second person if you want. On a miss...well you are dead already.

In play the vest was never triggered so I'm unsure how well these moves would work.