[MY PLAYERS STAY THE EFF OUT] Is this a valid custom move?

Say I want to create a situation where a malign entity gets significant, mechanical hold over a character.  Can I write a move like this and not be full of shit?

When the Voice in the Southern Passage whispers into your head, the maelstrom rushes in to protect you.  Roll to Open Your Brain - if you succeed, I'll tell you something useful, as per the move.  If you fail, it's as if the Voice has hit you with In-brain Puppet Strings and rolled a 10+

Does that make sense?  I feel like blurring the line between PC and NPC is maybe a no-no?  I don't know.  I feel conflicted.

It's legal, well-formed, and not broken. Bringing it into your game is a little bit risky, but the stakes are probably pretty low ("hey, y'know, I don't like how that worked after all. Do overs"). Let us know how it plays!

You know your players.  It's a hard move but you can set it up more gradually, or you can rewrite the move to make it more like "Tell them the possible consequences and ask."

"The Voice in the Southern Passage is whispering to you.  You sense that if you let it in you might learn something really useful, but if things might go wrong you might lose control a little..."

You know your players.  It's a hard move but you can set it up more gradually, or you can rewrite the move to make it more like "Tell them the possible consequences and ask."

"The Voice in the Southern Passage is whispering to you.  You sense that if you let it in you might learn something really useful, but if things might go wrong you might lose control a little..."

I'm going to use it sparingly.  It's linked in a fairly complex way to a handful of other custom moves - the Voice is spreading a frenzy disease amongst the villagers and as they trace the source of it, they're going to find the Voice and then the whispering will start.  I'm going to make sure they have lots of warning before I spring this.

I have a custom move where, if the players fail their roll, they basically get automatically in-brain puppet-stringsed by an NPC. It hasn't come up yet, but I'm not worried about it at all.

Is In-Brain Puppet Strings exactly the thing you want for that situation? The main blurry bit is that it shifts agency to the NPC -- you, as MC, will be deciding when to spend the hold, and therefore The Voice will have to be played as an NPC, etc.

If In-Brain Puppet Strings isn't exactly it, you could always just link this to a custom move that a) is more precisely in line with The Voice's agenda and consequently b) can be structured to return agency to the PCs. (See: 'When it's got its claws into you...' from our game, for example; though we had some issues there as well, figuring out when the move should be rolled.)

I think the original move will work fine so long as you have very clear commands, and some sort of coherent guidelines (for yourself) on when you will spend the hold, and what for (harm or penalties to rolls.)

In my head, the Voice has a very clear agenda - a solid, obvious target that it's going to turn people against. The Voice is likely going to whisper to NPCs first, changing their behavior to follow this agenda. As the PCs get closer to it (and it's countdown clock reaches midnight) then this move will come into play.

Is In-Brain Puppet Strings exactly the thing you want for that situation? The main blurry bit is that it shifts agency to the NPC -- you, as MC, will be deciding when to spend the hold, and therefore The Voice will have to be played as an NPC, etc.

This doesn't bother me much, as there's already a precedent with it in two areas: the hypnotic move has NPCs spending hold and honestly, the MC can already just Inflict Harm whenever he wants anyway. So this move is really just flavor, which is fine. You don't really need a custom move to have the Voice hurt a PC long range for not fulfilling a command, in terms of mechanics. It's already there.

Personally, I wouldn't use In-Brain for this. I'd come up with a badass custom move that was different, just so my players wouldn't be like "Oh, it's using a brainer move". Something to make the Voice different and unique and something of an unknown quality. Same general idea, just slightly different mechanics.

Quote from: Daniel Wood on September 14, 2010, 05:13:13 AM

Is In-Brain Puppet Strings exactly the thing you want for that situation? The main blurry bit is that it shifts agency to the NPC -- you, as MC, will be deciding when to spend the hold, and therefore The Voice will have to be played as an NPC, etc.

This doesn't bother me much, as there's already a precedent with it in two areas: the hypnotic move has NPCs spending hold and honestly, the MC can already just Inflict Harm whenever he wants anyway. So this move is really just flavor, which is fine. You don't really need a custom move to have the Voice hurt a PC long range for not fulfilling a command, in terms of mechanics. It's already there.

Personally, I wouldn't use In-Brain for this. I'd come up with a badass custom move that was different, just so my players wouldn't be like "Oh, it's using a brainer move". Something to make the Voice different and unique and something of an unknown quality. Same general idea, just slightly different mechanics.

I wanted it to be a mechanically sound method of implanting "suggestions" in the head of the PCs so I just went with In-Brain Puppet Strings.  I'm modeling the mechanics of this move after that one.  Maybe I won't "say its name" instead.  Maybe I'll just say "if you miss, the Voice gets into your head and now, you know what it wants." or something. 

I've written a custom move for when/if the PCs dabbles in the drug Myth, which is a Threat (Affliction: Delusion, impulse: to dominate people's choices and actions). From memory, it goes something like this:

When a character takes a hit of Myth, roll +cool. The MC tells them something they get an impulse to do.
On a 10+, they take +1forward for as long as they're actively working towards their impulse and mark experience when they've fulfilled their impulse.
On a 7-9, they mark experience when they've fulfilled their impulse.
On a 6-, if they're not working towards their impulse, they have to Act Under Fire - on a 10+ they do it, on a 7-9 they're given a bargain, on a 6- they fail and the MC makes as hard of a move as she likes.
For each hit of Myth, increase that character's Myth Addiction Countdown Clock one section.

So rather than In-brain puppet strings, my move works more like the PC has been Manipulated/Seduced. Maybe that'll help, if you're concerned about puppet stringing your PCs?

I've got two threats in my game that have custom moves that give them hold over the players.  It's kinda similar to puppet strings, but I have the specific "orders" the move gives written down on the sheet.  For example, getting bitten by one of the psychic rats can give you the order (I call it an "urge") to "protect the rats." and 1 to 3 hold, depending on how the player rolled (can't remember +what) after being bitten.  They can remove the hold by acting on the urge, and until they do, at any time I can spend the hold one-for-one to cause 1 harm AP or give them a -1 on a roll (which I think are things you can do with puppet strings, right?)

so as you can probably guess, it sounds pretty okay to me since your move is a more flexible version of something I'm using myself.  :)  though I have wondered for awhile whether my moves were decent or not, they seem to be working okay in-game.

What I'm really going to be doing here is using the Puppet Strings mechanic to give an NPC another venue through which to pursue its Threat Impulses.  So in its efforts to "generate badness" the Voice is going to take up residence in the heads of the people around it. 

I know that, generally speaking, Landscapes are physical places but the Voice exists in a very limited physical form and exists in a sort of psychic landscape present in the minds of the people around it.  It's got this sort of adversarial relationship with the Maelstrom that I haven't fully played out but I think is covered in the description of the move, as well.

I've written a custom move for when/if the PCs dabbles in the drug Myth, which is a Threat (Affliction: Delusion, impulse: to dominate people's choices and actions). From memory, it goes something like this:

When a character takes a hit of Myth, roll +cool. The MC tells them something they get an impulse to do.
On a 10+, they take +1forward for as long as they're actively working towards their impulse and mark experience when they've fulfilled their impulse.
On a 7-9, they mark experience when they've fulfilled their impulse.
On a 6-, if they're not working towards their impulse, they have to Act Under Fire - on a 10+ they do it, on a 7-9 they're given a bargain, on a 6- they fail and the MC makes as hard of a move as she likes.
For each hit of Myth, increase that character's Myth Addiction Countdown Clock one section.

One of my threats has a custom move that involves taking a drug, but this is way better. I'm making my drug a threat and am probably just going to steal your move whole-cloth. Thanks!

Iachek--just wanted you to know, I used Myth in my game tonight, and it rocked. None of the PC's have taken it yet, but it really colored all the goings-on and affected the fiction in a big way through NPCs. I've PMed you about that Myth Countdown Clock. Care to share it? Should any of the PCs take it next session I'd love to have the Countdown on hand. Otherwise I suppose I'll have to make one myself. Thanks again, man.

Thanks Hans! Got your PM and I'm not ignoring you, just stupid busy at the moment. I'll write out that Addiction countdown clock in a separate thread in a day or so. Glad you found it useful! The players in my game have declined taking it so far - for some reason they're perfectly happy chopping people's heads off with swords, but taking drugs is where they draw the line. ;)