questions on beta

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Re: questions on beta
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2012, 05:02:10 AM »
http://apocalypse-world.com/forums/index.php?topic=2956.msg17867#msg17867

they basically become rotes/cantrips. I think they are rewording the entire thing to make it clearer.
Oh, the things we tell ourselves to feel better about the long, dark nights.

Re: questions on beta
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2012, 11:17:08 AM »
I'm guessing that will end up looking like "Get one for free, additional preparations are at normal cost" since you can't prep rotes more than once (I assume) and losing the ability to multi-prep the spell probably isn't an intended feature of the advance(?).

Re: questions on beta
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2012, 09:38:50 PM »
New question: What are the limits to the Paladin's "I am the law" move?

Context: The paladin in my game has used it to good effect before. Now he is using it on a group of magically created and commanded beings. I'm not even sure they can understand him. They sure don't respect divine authority, on their own, anyway.

Should I interpret "an NPC" to mean this move can never affect more than one NPC at once?

Can it affect any NPC? A dragon? A golem? A demon? A donkey?

Re: questions on beta
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2012, 09:52:00 PM »
In my games, divine authority affected basically everything. However, it's not such a powerful move, and it's best used against people who don't want to attack you, or else it has no effect, since they were going to attack the paladin any way.
Oh, the things we tell ourselves to feel better about the long, dark nights.

Re: questions on beta
« Reply #19 on: July 22, 2012, 09:31:29 AM »
In my games, divine authority affected basically everything. However, it's not such a powerful move, and it's best used against people who don't want to attack you, or else it has no effect, since they were going to attack the paladin any way.
It's fairly powerful--if it can affect anyone and any number of anyones, then it's kind of an unlimited defend move, with only the choice of redirecting the attack toward you. And since the paladin has heavier armor and better HP than many of her/his allies, and may want to defend innocent victims, it seems to have a lot of heft.

I don't want to take away part of what makes the Paladin cool, but I also don't want a situation where the paladin just turns on the attack magnet and suddenly none of the NPCs present have any options.

Re: questions on beta
« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2012, 11:38:31 AM »
But that is what the paladin is all about! :P Defend the others! However, I actually didn't answer to what you asked. I'm sorry!

I'm not even sure they can understand him.
I think that what "giving an order" means varies upon the fiction and the group. However, probably he must be able to speak and be listened and understood by the NPC. "A voice that trascends language" is a powerful boon for the paladin's quest!

also
Should I interpret "an NPC" to mean this move can never affect more than one NPC at once?
in my games yes, the paladins always use it to end up in one-on-one duels. It seems natural (and Exterminatus fits it).

That said, it's not written anywhere that they must keep attacking only you. I mean, after they attacked you, they are free to do as they please. I think.
Oh, the things we tell ourselves to feel better about the long, dark nights.

*

Jeremy

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Re: questions on beta
« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2012, 11:40:04 AM »
The game text never defines "NPC."  There's an implication througout, though, that NPCs are characters with motive, feeling, and agenda.  All of the moves and references to NPCs imply that.  That would make me less inclined to have it work on a mindless automaton.

The move requires that give an order based on your divine authority.  What does that look like in play?  If you're raising your voice with something like "In Bahamut's name, stop where you are!" then the recipient probably needs to understand your language (or at least your meaning and recognize Bahamut's name or holy symbol) for it to trigger the move. 

Also... check out the Boons.  Two of them play into this directly: a mark of divine authority and a voice that transcends language.  If you've got that mark, any order you give could be based on your divine authority... even mindless undead could be affected.  And a voice that transcends language?  Well, now everyone (maybe everything) can understand you and your command.  Move got a lot more powerful right there.

All that then interacts with the nature of the target in your game.  Is a golem truly a mindless construct? Or a sentient elemental spirit bound by a wizard's magic? Or a new soul imbued into the construct by the Word of Creation carved into its forehead?  Are zombies mindless corpses animated by some vile energy or virus?  Or are they tormented souls with the vestage of their former lives?  The answers there would impact whether you considered them "NPCs" or not, and what was required to invoke your divine authority against them.

It's fairly powerful--if it can affect anyone and any number of anyones, then it's kind of an unlimited defend move, with only the choice of redirecting the attack toward you. And since the paladin has heavier armor and better HP than many of her/his allies, and may want to defend innocent victims, it seems to have a lot of heft.

I don't want to take away part of what makes the Paladin cool, but I also don't want a situation where the paladin just turns on the attack magnet and suddenly none of the NPCs present have any options.

Yup.  Pretty aswesome, especially if the paladin's on a quest with a boon that makes them invulnerable to the undead or something like that.  Be a fan of the characters!  There's plenty of ways they can still get in hot water.

Re: questions on beta
« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2012, 07:07:48 PM »
Transcends language, a? I am the law, a? What about the laws of physics?

"Fiery waters, belched up from Gluxodis' hell, PART! Part for the righteous! Part for the innocent! Part for the beset and imperilled! Part in the name of Ueat the All Mighty!"

"Halt this terminable descent! Halt my fall! I judge this gravity unjust and demand my freedom from its tyranny! HALT!"

Re: questions on beta
« Reply #23 on: July 22, 2012, 08:02:48 PM »
As a GM, I would allow it.

If anything, just to see gravity attacking the paladin.
Oh, the things we tell ourselves to feel better about the long, dark nights.