Chatty DM's Front Model.

[noofy]

Hey Dudes and Dudettes,
I realise that most of you have already read it, but I wanted to link Chatty DM's ideas on AW Front design as applied to Dungeons in his Blog:
http://critical-hits.com/2010/09/24/re-examining-the-dungeon-section-factions-and-fronts/

It particularly formalised and structured the adhoc improv model I've been using in the first few sessions. (Similar to what happened when we played AW!) It sorta hit me over the head that despite being such an iconic trope of D&D, the dungeon is just setting; a front for the threats.

Instead of drawing up a few maps (or stealing one page dungeons) tossing them at the players and then populating, now I'm thinking of the threats within, how they engage with the players and moulding the dungeon to suit them. I'm even applying the scarcity concept to the players resources and how the monster groups / traps / puzzles threaten them. Obvious but awesome.

I'm pretty excited to see Sage and Adam's ideas on Fronts and Threats and Dungeon Design! :)

[wightbred]

I missed this, but it is a solid gold way to integrate AW and D&D.

Reminds me of a post by Fuseboy on the BW forums that helped me "get" story games: "Rather than thinking of the characters as a means to explore the dungeon, try thinking of the dungeon as a means of exploring the characters." - Fuseboy, BW forums

I really want to see what Sage and Adam can do with Fronts as well, but we are too caught up with other games to play, post and get in the Guild.

[d.anderson]

This is exactly what I was trying with my version; Fronts are "adventures", centered on "opportunities" that are surrounded by "challenges".  Because DW is not pointed in the same direction as AW (like, almost all Fronts and Threats are direct or oblique pressure on human relationships), it took me a while to mull over what the better parts of my dungeon-crawling experiences were and where the pressures were pointed (these particular kind of direct and oblique challenges standing in the way of these particular kind of opportunities).

For me and the way I best enjoy playing and running dungeon-crawl-style games, these really make a dungeon map an organic web of active, interactive, and reactive dangers and possibilities completely primed for adventurers.  They have the same intuitive ease of generation and reference that Fronts and Threats possess for the MC in AW (for me, at least).

[sage]

Yup, I've read Chatty's article, and we're actually on very much the same page. I actually thought about commenting on that post when it came out, but didn't want to be a snobby indie "already did that" gamer. At his point Chatty knows about DW - he's in the Guild, actually.

There's not a whole lot I can add, really. I should probably reread the entire post and the entire Fronts chapter again, but I'm pretty sure we say basically the same things. Chatty spends a little more time on actual physical dungeons, but we have the front types, which are some of the most inspiring RPG lists I've read for a fantasy game. Adam absolutely killed those.

[noofy]

Sweet! Thanks Guys, I wasn't making my Carouse move, promise! I feel like such an antipodean sometimes - lost on the colonial fringe.

Anyways, I also thought of Burning Wheel Lovin' might be appropriate considering all our backrounds. Now I know the 'Guild' is privy to such delights due to their dabbling in the BW-verse, but for those friendly readers that haven't partaken, this article by Thor is most revealing (and applicable to DW) about what a Dungeon really is mechanically speaking.
http://www.burningwheel.org/forum/showthread.php?3505-[Workshop]-BW-the-Old-School-Way/page5

Post 46 is the gem for DW, but there is some marvelous picking throughout the whole thread, so long as you avoid overly 'pre-planning' the plot. The Adventure Burner too, has a great Map of Tony's turned into a story games dungeon, with advice on making your own. I found that chapter invaluable as we created the Bugbear Dance Party Dungeon on the fly, mechanically supported by judicous interpretations of Discern Knowledge and Adventure hook moves!

[wightbred]

Looks like you got a 10+ on Carouse anyway. Time to level up.

I feel the same way over here sometimes. On the fringe of the action when I hear from guys get to play regularly with Tony D. catch up for a beer to brainstorm with John Harper or first played it with Vincent at a con. At least we have this forum.

Will check out the BW stuff.